Suns News: The Offseason (2016)

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Mori Chu
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Re: Suns News: The Offseason (2016)

Post by Mori Chu »

It probably doesn't help that the coaching staff and FO can't decide what kind of player they want him to be, so they have him both bulking up and practicing long-distance shooting, etc. I wish they would work on his inside game and D/Rebounding exclusively and forget about the "Stretch 5" stuff.

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Ring_Wanted
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Re: Suns News: The Offseason (2016)

Post by Ring_Wanted »

I think the highest potential is precisely at the stretch role. You just won't make a post threat out of him. He doesn't have the fluidity and above all awareness to develop enough of a post game. And honestly that's just not who he is. I say keep it easy under the rim as a finisher and try to get him a reliable shot so he can be a triple threat. If he becomes consistent from midrange (let alone capable of scoring threes) we have solved the center position for the next 10 years.

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Cap
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Re: Suns News: The Offseason (2016)

Post by Cap »

At the same time, don't ignore the post game. At that size, it's important to have the basic post-up skills to exploit mismatches when they happen. A 7-footer who can't post up is a place where opponents can hide poor defenders.

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Ring_Wanted
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Re: Suns News: The Offseason (2016)

Post by Ring_Wanted »

Problem is it's the basics he lacks. You just can't trust him to turn to the right side or use the correct angle. By all means try to drill it into his head but personally I am not confident he'll ever be proficient in this area so in my opinion the time and effort are better invested in a face to the basket game, which is nothing without a respectable shot. High post, triple threat, roll man, defensive wall.

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Nodack
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Re: Suns News: The Offseason (2016)

Post by Nodack »

He looks real bad sometimes and real good sometimes. Inconsistent. I think he was ready to be the starting center last year and then we got Chandler. I don't know what that does to a guys mental state but, it had to be a let down. Overall I am pretty happy with his progress. The mentality of having him not do the things he's not good at is flawed IMO. I say do them even more often until he does get it, otherwise why bother? Just dump him for the next upcoming center with flaws that we will dump a few years down the road for the same reasons. Patience is something most basketball fans lack.

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Indy
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Re: Suns News: The Offseason (2016)

Post by Indy »

The mentality of having him not do the things he's not good at is flawed IMO.
There is a philosophy that says you should focus on your strengths. Hone them until they are great, because you are already good at them and have a knack for them. And don't worry about your weaknesses nearly as much. I think that is the right approach for him, instead of trying to turn him into something he isn't. I know we had this argument before, but you wouldn't start asking him to lead fast breaks, or initiate the pick-and-roll, or defend the other team's best back court player. Those are certainly extreme examples, but it goes to the point of focus. He can't do everything; so let's encourage his natural talents. He has likely always been the biggest kid on his team, and didn't have similar competition growing up. So he didn't have to learn those skills over 10 years of playing ball where there was always someone bigger and stronger than you. When that happens, you don't learn to be crafty. He isn't crafty and I doubt he will ever be. So that's OK, and let's teach him more about his talents.

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Nodack
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Re: Suns News: The Offseason (2016)

Post by Nodack »

IMO he is our Center. Like all Centers he should be good at defending the rim on Defense and getting rebounds on both ends. On offense as a Center IMO he should be good at putting the ball in the hoop posting up and if he can hit a mid range shot that would be awesome. If he can hit an outside shot that is just icing on the cake. Those are standard things all Centers are supposed to strive for IMO. IMO Len is capable of all those things. He hasn't been consistent but, he has gotten it done a number of times. He has a sweet stroke and can hit shots from just about anywhere. If I'm the coach I keep working on all those things with Len.

As a Center I don't think any team wants their Center to run the fast break of defend guards. That's just basic BBall.

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Indy
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Re: Suns News: The Offseason (2016)

Post by Indy »

Nodack wrote:IMO he is our Center. Like all Centers he should be good at defending the rim on Defense and getting rebounds on both ends. On offense as a Center IMO he should be good at putting the ball in the hoop posting up and if he can hit a mid range shot that would be awesome. If he can hit an outside shot that is just icing on the cake. Those are standard things all Centers are supposed to strive for IMO. IMO Len is capable of all those things. He hasn't been consistent but, he has gotten it done a number of times. He has a sweet stroke and can hit shots from just about anywhere. If I'm the coach I keep working on all those things with Len.

As a Center I don't think any team wants their Center to run the fast break of defend guards. That's just basic BBall.
I don't think it is as basic as you make it out. How many times combined did you see Biyombo, Amare, Bogut, Plumlee, Duncan, and Adams post up? Those are the only starting centers left in the playoffs this year, and I don't see any of them regularly posting up. I don't think your center has to do that to be effective. He has to do something that the other team can't stop him from doing, on both ends of the floor.

I hope he somehow turns into a monster on the block in two years; I just haven't seen any indication that it will happen. There are too many guys in the league that can take that away from him, where he is out-matched. But when he is standing at the FT line, and can hit that shot, he pulls his defender away from the hoop and lets our strength work (penetrating guards and SFs).

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Ring_Wanted
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Re: Suns News: The Offseason (2016)

Post by Ring_Wanted »

Nodack wrote: I say do them even more often until he does get it, otherwise why bother?
Because usually guys are not blank canvases, and there are different ways a player can impact a game from the same position but only a limited amount of training a player can put up. And speaking about confidence, making someone go again and again at something he is not naturally talented and inclined to do is a good recipe for frustration.

Len has showed a decent shooting touch but has given no indication that he can be a factor in the post, besides his size. Actually it's been the opposite, from difficulty to grab passes (sure, less than perfect passes, but big men do make passes good with their hands as well) to the alluded lack of spatial awareness (which to me is absolutely the telling factor here). But he is tall. The thing is some guys are athletic as hell but just can't use their gifts 'the right way'. In this case I don't even think he is gifted, and thus such a waste, once you consider other factors. You can be robotic but strong (Valanciunas), slow but smooth (BroLo), slim but explosive (Hakeem); yet the only common factor is 'brain'. David Robinson, Howard, Amare himself all were fabulously equiped to play under the basket but it never became their strong suit. I believe Len has the same problem but of course that doesn't make me want to give up on him, as I see a number of things he does well already, plus potential in other areas.

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carey
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Re: Suns News: The Offseason (2016)

Post by carey »

https://twitter.com/PaolaBoivin/status/730444330607878144

Go Suns!

Og Snus!

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Superbone
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Re: Suns News: The Offseason (2016)

Post by Superbone »

Another great Earl Watson interview on Bickley and Marotta:

http://arizonasports.com/player/?a=321513

You haters should listen to it. Good stuff. One of the highlights was Watson and Booker both vacationing in California so Watson set up a practice session and Baron Davis joined in to impart his knowledge. Watson has had to deal with adversity his whole life and he has proven time and again that he is up for it. My prediction is that Watson will change your perception of him in a favorable manner by the all-star break. Mark it down!
"Be Legendary."

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TOO
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Re: Suns News: The Offseason (2016)

Post by TOO »

Superbone wrote:Another great Earl Watson interview on Bickley and Marotta:

http://arizonasports.com/player/?a=321513

You haters should listen to it. Good stuff. One of the highlights was Watson and Booker both vacationing in California so Watson set up a practice session and Baron Davis joined in to impart his knowledge. Watson has had to deal with adversity his whole life and he has proven time and again that he is up for it. My prediction is that Watson will change your perception of him in a favorable manner by the all-star break. Mark it down!
But but but... He's not the almighty Luke Walton!
👀 Fire Frank Vogel.

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ShelC
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Re: Suns News: The Offseason (2016)

Post by ShelC »

I can't wait until Baron Davis is in training camp with us.

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JCSunsfan
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Re: Suns News: The Offseason (2016)

Post by JCSunsfan »

TheOriginalOriginal wrote:
Superbone wrote:Another great Earl Watson interview on Bickley and Marotta:

http://arizonasports.com/player/?a=321513

You haters should listen to it. Good stuff. One of the highlights was Watson and Booker both vacationing in California so Watson set up a practice session and Baron Davis joined in to impart his knowledge. Watson has had to deal with adversity his whole life and he has proven time and again that he is up for it. My prediction is that Watson will change your perception of him in a favorable manner by the all-star break. Mark it down!
But but but... He's not the almighty Luke Walton!
No, that's not the problem! We should have interviewed 50 candidates and THEN hired him because that would make him a better hire.

Wh knows? someone better may have come along. . .

And they might have hired him instead of us.

EDC
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Re: Suns News: The Offseason (2016)

Post by EDC »

A practice session with Baron Davis! Well hell if we knew he could set up a session with Davis no one would have doubted Watson's coaching genius. This definitely changes my mind. It all begins to make sense. McD must have known this and that is why he didn't bother to interview anyone else.

We are headed straight to the top guys!

I wonder what other top secret special coaching moves he has that we don't know about yet.

Oh I found one!

Image

He has met Steve Nash. I can't wait until he passes on all of Nash's knowledge to Booker, Bogdan and Goodwin. We will have three Nashes on our team! How can we lose?


:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

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Indy
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Re: Suns News: The Offseason (2016)

Post by Indy »

JCSunsfan wrote:
TheOriginalOriginal wrote:
Superbone wrote:Another great Earl Watson interview on Bickley and Marotta:

http://arizonasports.com/player/?a=321513

You haters should listen to it. Good stuff. One of the highlights was Watson and Booker both vacationing in California so Watson set up a practice session and Baron Davis joined in to impart his knowledge. Watson has had to deal with adversity his whole life and he has proven time and again that he is up for it. My prediction is that Watson will change your perception of him in a favorable manner by the all-star break. Mark it down!
But but but... He's not the almighty Luke Walton!
No, that's not the problem! We should have interviewed 50 candidates and THEN hired him because that would make him a better hire.

Wh knows? someone better may have come along. . .

And they might have hired him instead of us.
At the very least, you should read the menu before ordering at a new restaurant.

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gosuns
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Re: Suns News: The Offseason (2016)

Post by gosuns »

Bogdanovic is playing right now. Euroleague final four semi. Fenerbahce vs Vitoria. Interesting to see how he performs on the biggest European stage.

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gosuns
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Re: Suns News: The Offseason (2016)

Post by gosuns »

Fener is loaded with former NBA players. Antic, Udoh, Datome. Bogdan handles the ball a lot and looks improved on it. 13-0 start. Bogdan is still scoreless. Vitoria is finally on the board. Bobby Dixon of Fener is like IT 2.0.

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gosuns
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Re: Suns News: The Offseason (2016)

Post by gosuns »

Tough start for Bogdanovic. 3 turns early before finally hitting a 3. 1 quarter over 23 - 15 Fener leads.

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gosuns
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Re: Suns News: The Offseason (2016)

Post by gosuns »

Jan Vesely is the early MVP. Very phisical game so far. Bogdan with a nice assist on the pick and roll for a jam.

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