Suns sign Rubio

[Ring_Wanted]

Ricky is having a great World tournament. He is the absolute engine moving Spain (never happened before).

[Ring_Wanted]

This is the best roster we’ve had since we last made the playoffs.

I don't think this is better team than '13-14, for instance (maybe even until Dragic was traded, in my opinion). It's not a tanking or neglected roster but it has holes and a lot of question marks. The potential is way higher of course.

[Split T]

No, In2. We're looking at the players, roster, moves over the summer etc. It doesn't look that different from what we've been doing. A little better, but not a lot.

How does it not look different? When was the last time we weren’t counting on any minutes from g league level players?

Yes, some people applauded the Ariza signing(including me), but that was 1 player. We were still banking on josh Jackson, dragan Bender, Isaiah Canaan, and a couple rookie pg’s for real rotation minutes. I don’t remember anyone thinking Ryan Anderson was actually going to be a big help...some were hopeful, but most everyone on here New he was washed.

Since James Jones took over, we’ve added Kelly Oubre, Tyler Johnson, Dario Saric, Aron Baynes, Cam Johnson, Ty Jerome, Jalen Lecque, Ricky Rubio, Frank Kaminsky, and Cheik Diallo. That somehow equates to adding Trevor Ariza and Ryan Anderson?

C’mon...this team clearly was built drastically different than any McD team. I’m not saying that means we will succeed, but if this team doesn’t work, it’s not because we didn’t have nba players. We’ve got a legit 8 man rotation of real life nba players. When could we last say that? And that doesn’t include Cam Johnson or Ty Jerome, both of whom I think have nba ready skills.

Nobody is equating that. Some of us are saying that counting our chicks before they hatch has shown, over the last many years, to be a poor way to figure out how many real chicks we will have.

This summer does look different. But we are again starting with a brand new coaching staff, I still haven't heard about any scout hirings, we let Aaron Nelson go and outsourced his team's job, and decided to go with a draft approach of "I don't think this guy's floor will be too low, so I don't care how high his ceiling is and happy to blow the $$ I saved by trading down to take him" instead of taking some guys that had a good opportunity to fit well next to Ayton in the front court. It very well may work out. But it isn't a likely outcome. If it were, our over/under by people that literally only make money if they are close on that would be high-30s, instead of high 20s.

I am still optimistic that we will beat the over/under, but not enough to say we are going to be high 30s or pushing .500 ball. Or even like some are saying, we will be pushing for the playoffs.

OG said this offseason wasn’t that different from past ones. That’s mostly what I was responding too.

As for over/under, I’m not too worried about that. They are going to base a lot of that off public perception as the public is who they are trying to trick. I just listened to a few podcasts with a gambling expert who thinks the over on the suns is easy money.

I also don’t think we’re a high 30’s win team. 35 is my goal. I think I’d put the over/under around 31/32

[Split T]

I really don't understand how you can compare last year's offseason to this one. It was obvious in hindsight that we began and played most of the season with an unbalanced roster. This year is the opposite. I would be extremely surprised if we're having this same conversation a year from now.

Who knows what this year's hindsight will bring.

ding. ding. ding.

Does everyone forget how much we were clapping ourselves on the back for adding a "generational center" to our team with our first ever #1 pick in the draft? He still has time, but last year he was completely ineffectual and our opponents shot 7% BETTER at the rim when he was on the court.

I am just saying that our foresight and our hindsight seem to be as far apart as any team in the league. And we should learn from that.

Look how crazy we went when we got those 48 wins under Jeff. We thought the rebuild was over and we were on our way back to the playoffs the next year for sure. That was 6 years ago. Our 5 seasons since then have given us an average of 25 wins. I think it is fair to assume we will be better than that average, but assuming we will blow it away the next few years is pure optimism, and not based in evidence.

You don't need hindsight to see that this is a much, much better balanced roster.

OK, but people were saying that last summer, too. Ooh, look we added a generational center to replace that bum Alex Len and Tyson Chandler. Ooh, we added a really tenacious defender and great 3pt shooter in the front court. Ooh, JJ will come into his own this year. Oh, Bender will have the room to play minutes that will help the team this year. And don't worry, we will trade for a real PG any minute now.

That is how we were talking.

That’s fair, but those were all situations where we were hoping for improvements from young unproven players. This year our rotation is full of proven nba players. It just feels like your point is that being optimistic is dumb. I don’t have any issue with you being skeptical about the team, but I’m not going to stop being optimistic because those thoughts have been wrong in regards to the suns lately.

[O_Gardino]

No, In2. We're looking at the players, roster, moves over the summer etc. It doesn't look that different from what we've been doing. A little better, but not a lot.

How does it not look different? When was the last time we weren’t counting on any minutes from g league level players?

Yes, some people applauded the Ariza signing(including me), but that was 1 player. We were still banking on josh Jackson, dragan Bender, Isaiah Canaan, and a couple rookie pg’s for real rotation minutes. I don’t remember anyone thinking Ryan Anderson was actually going to be a big help...some were hopeful, but most everyone on here New he was washed.

Since James Jones took over, we’ve added Kelly Oubre, Tyler Johnson, Dario Saric, Aron Baynes, Cam Johnson, Ty Jerome, Jalen Lecque, Ricky Rubio, Frank Kaminsky, and Cheik Diallo. That somehow equates to adding Trevor Ariza and Ryan Anderson?

C’mon...this team clearly was built drastically different than any McD team. I’m not saying that means we will succeed, but if this team doesn’t work, it’s not because we didn’t have nba players. We’ve got a legit 8 man rotation of real life nba players. When could we last say that? And that doesn’t include Cam Johnson or Ty Jerome, both of whom I think have nba ready skills.

Sure, those guys are ok. That's why I expect us to win more games. But those guys aren't very good nba players, so I don't expect us to win a lot more games.

[Indy]

Who knows what this year's hindsight will bring.

ding. ding. ding.

Does everyone forget how much we were clapping ourselves on the back for adding a "generational center" to our team with our first ever #1 pick in the draft? He still has time, but last year he was completely ineffectual and our opponents shot 7% BETTER at the rim when he was on the court.

I am just saying that our foresight and our hindsight seem to be as far apart as any team in the league. And we should learn from that.

Look how crazy we went when we got those 48 wins under Jeff. We thought the rebuild was over and we were on our way back to the playoffs the next year for sure. That was 6 years ago. Our 5 seasons since then have given us an average of 25 wins. I think it is fair to assume we will be better than that average, but assuming we will blow it away the next few years is pure optimism, and not based in evidence.

You don't need hindsight to see that this is a much, much better balanced roster.

OK, but people were saying that last summer, too. Ooh, look we added a generational center to replace that bum Alex Len and Tyson Chandler. Ooh, we added a really tenacious defender and great 3pt shooter in the front court. Ooh, JJ will come into his own this year. Oh, Bender will have the room to play minutes that will help the team this year. And don't worry, we will trade for a real PG any minute now.

That is how we were talking.

That’s fair, but those were all situations where we were hoping for improvements from young unproven players. This year our rotation is full of proven nba players. It just feels like your point is that being optimistic is dumb. I don’t have any issue with you being skeptical about the team, but I’m not going to stop being optimistic because those thoughts have been wrong in regards to the suns lately.

Not asking to change your optimism. It is one of the reasons I love reading folks here. I think this all started by someone saying that a low 30s win number would be an awful year for this team. I think that is crazy, because it would be worlds better than we have been this decade. I am just saying to temper the optimism with a little hindsight. This time of year we all get really hopeful. I am sure there were plenty of us expecting a 40 win season last year after our first game against Dallas.

[In2ition]

Honestly, Indy brought up a couple things that are little worrisome. Do we know exactly what kind of training staff they have and how they've replaced or rebuilt the scouting staff? I also think that the thing to worry about the most is if the Suns get off to a slow start, will Sarver be able to keep himself from walking down to the coaches office to fire them up or do something drastically shortsighted?

[Indy]

Ricky is having a great World tournament. He is the absolute engine moving Spain (never happened before).

Let's hope all that mileage doesn't catch up to him, especially since we let our training staff walk. He turns 29 right after the season starts.

[Indy]

Honestly, Indy brought up a couple things that are little worrisome. Do we know exactly what kind of training staff they have and how they've replaced or rebuilt the scouting staff? I also think that the thing to worry about the most is if the Suns get off to a slow start, will Sarver be able to keep himself from walking down to the coaches office to fire them up or do something drastically shortsighted?

Let's hope Monty carries enough weight for that last part. I am not sure though. I think there is a reason Sarver doesn't hire experienced head coaches.

[In2ition]

ding. ding. ding.

Does everyone forget how much we were clapping ourselves on the back for adding a "generational center" to our team with our first ever #1 pick in the draft? He still has time, but last year he was completely ineffectual and our opponents shot 7% BETTER at the rim when he was on the court.

I am just saying that our foresight and our hindsight seem to be as far apart as any team in the league. And we should learn from that.

Look how crazy we went when we got those 48 wins under Jeff. We thought the rebuild was over and we were on our way back to the playoffs the next year for sure. That was 6 years ago. Our 5 seasons since then have given us an average of 25 wins. I think it is fair to assume we will be better than that average, but assuming we will blow it away the next few years is pure optimism, and not based in evidence.

You don't need hindsight to see that this is a much, much better balanced roster.

OK, but people were saying that last summer, too. Ooh, look we added a generational center to replace that bum Alex Len and Tyson Chandler. Ooh, we added a really tenacious defender and great 3pt shooter in the front court. Ooh, JJ will come into his own this year. Oh, Bender will have the room to play minutes that will help the team this year. And don't worry, we will trade for a real PG any minute now.

That is how we were talking.

That’s fair, but those were all situations where we were hoping for improvements from young unproven players. This year our rotation is full of proven nba players. It just feels like your point is that being optimistic is dumb. I don’t have any issue with you being skeptical about the team, but I’m not going to stop being optimistic because those thoughts have been wrong in regards to the suns lately.

Not asking to change your optimism. It is one of the reasons I love reading folks here. I think this all started by someone saying that a low 30s win number would be an awful year for this team. I think that is crazy, because it would be worlds better than we have been this decade. I am just saying to temper the optimism with a little hindsight. This time of year we all get really hopeful. I am sure there were plenty of us expecting a 40 win season last year after our first game against Dallas.

That was me and I stand by what I said. I'll be happy for anyone here if they are stoked about winning 30 games this year, but to me it will be horrible. I'll be happy that they are much better and more competitive than they have been the past 4 yrs, but extremely disappointed that it wasn't more. I just think that will be the beginning of the end for the Booker era.

[Split T]

ding. ding. ding.

Does everyone forget how much we were clapping ourselves on the back for adding a "generational center" to our team with our first ever #1 pick in the draft? He still has time, but last year he was completely ineffectual and our opponents shot 7% BETTER at the rim when he was on the court.

I am just saying that our foresight and our hindsight seem to be as far apart as any team in the league. And we should learn from that.

Look how crazy we went when we got those 48 wins under Jeff. We thought the rebuild was over and we were on our way back to the playoffs the next year for sure. That was 6 years ago. Our 5 seasons since then have given us an average of 25 wins. I think it is fair to assume we will be better than that average, but assuming we will blow it away the next few years is pure optimism, and not based in evidence.

You don't need hindsight to see that this is a much, much better balanced roster.

OK, but people were saying that last summer, too. Ooh, look we added a generational center to replace that bum Alex Len and Tyson Chandler. Ooh, we added a really tenacious defender and great 3pt shooter in the front court. Ooh, JJ will come into his own this year. Oh, Bender will have the room to play minutes that will help the team this year. And don't worry, we will trade for a real PG any minute now.

That is how we were talking.

That’s fair, but those were all situations where we were hoping for improvements from young unproven players. This year our rotation is full of proven nba players. It just feels like your point is that being optimistic is dumb. I don’t have any issue with you being skeptical about the team, but I’m not going to stop being optimistic because those thoughts have been wrong in regards to the suns lately.

Not asking to change your optimism. It is one of the reasons I love reading folks here. I think this all started by someone saying that a low 30s win number would be an awful year for this team. I think that is crazy, because it would be worlds better than we have been this decade. I am just saying to temper the optimism with a little hindsight. This time of year we all get really hopeful. I am sure there were plenty of us expecting a 40 win season last year after our first game against Dallas.

Gotcha, ya that’s fair. I’m hoping for more than low 30’s, but by no means would that be an awful year.

[Indy]

Not asking to change your optimism. It is one of the reasons I love reading folks here. I think this all started by someone saying that a low 30s win number would be an awful year for this team. I think that is crazy, because it would be worlds better than we have been this decade. I am just saying to temper the optimism with a little hindsight. This time of year we all get really hopeful. I am sure there were plenty of us expecting a 40 win season last year after our first game against Dallas.

That was me and I stand by what I said. I'll be happy for anyone here if they are stoked about winning 30 games this year, but to me it will be horrible. I'll be happy that they are much better and more competitive than they have been the past 4 yrs, but extremely disappointed that it wasn't more. I just think that will be the beginning of the end for the Booker era.

I guess if 32 wins is a terrible year, why would you have been a fan this decade?

I would be really happy with nearly any win total if I saw a focused, well-appointed, and really smart front office come into shape. I just want to know that the people in charge of the ship that I have given my fandom to for the last +30 years actually know what they are doing, and can do it better than most of the people playing the game.

My expectation is we will see more of the same from the FO, but have a better performance on the floor this year.

My hope is that we have a year like we haven't seen in a dozen years and we are arguing about how much to throw at Saric to stay here next year after our playoff run.

[Split T]

No, In2. We're looking at the players, roster, moves over the summer etc. It doesn't look that different from what we've been doing. A little better, but not a lot.

How does it not look different? When was the last time we weren’t counting on any minutes from g league level players?

Yes, some people applauded the Ariza signing(including me), but that was 1 player. We were still banking on josh Jackson, dragan Bender, Isaiah Canaan, and a couple rookie pg’s for real rotation minutes. I don’t remember anyone thinking Ryan Anderson was actually going to be a big help...some were hopeful, but most everyone on here New he was washed.

Since James Jones took over, we’ve added Kelly Oubre, Tyler Johnson, Dario Saric, Aron Baynes, Cam Johnson, Ty Jerome, Jalen Lecque, Ricky Rubio, Frank Kaminsky, and Cheik Diallo. That somehow equates to adding Trevor Ariza and Ryan Anderson?

C’mon...this team clearly was built drastically different than any McD team. I’m not saying that means we will succeed, but if this team doesn’t work, it’s not because we didn’t have nba players. We’ve got a legit 8 man rotation of real life nba players. When could we last say that? And that doesn’t include Cam Johnson or Ty Jerome, both of whom I think have nba ready skills.

Sure, those guys are ok. That's why I expect us to win more games. But those guys aren't very good nba players, so I don't expect us to win a lot more games.

I think you might be underselling them a little bit. They’re not all stars, but Saric and Rubio have been starters on playoff teams. Those are good nba players.

[In2ition]

Not asking to change your optimism. It is one of the reasons I love reading folks here. I think this all started by someone saying that a low 30s win number would be an awful year for this team. I think that is crazy, because it would be worlds better than we have been this decade. I am just saying to temper the optimism with a little hindsight. This time of year we all get really hopeful. I am sure there were plenty of us expecting a 40 win season last year after our first game against Dallas.

That was me and I stand by what I said. I'll be happy for anyone here if they are stoked about winning 30 games this year, but to me it will be horrible. I'll be happy that they are much better and more competitive than they have been the past 4 yrs, but extremely disappointed that it wasn't more. I just think that will be the beginning of the end for the Booker era.

I guess if 32 wins is a terrible year, why would you have been a fan this decade?

I would be really happy with nearly any win total if I saw a focused, well-appointed, and really smart front office come into shape. I just want to know that the people in charge of the ship that I have given my fandom to for the last +30 years actually know what they are doing, and can do it better than most of the people playing the game.

My expectation is we will see more of the same from the FO, but have a better performance on the floor this year.

My hope is that we have a year like we haven't seen in a dozen years and we are arguing about how much to throw at Saric to stay here next year after our playoff run.

I would have ok with 30 wins last year. Yeah the last 4 seasons have been horrible with the exception of some glimmer of hope with the young guys. I didn't have as much of an expectation on those years though, since the talent level was so obviously poor.

I've been a fan of the Suns for 30 years too. I don't think years of fandom make someone more of a fan than someone else though.

I'm not giving up my fandom of the team because they sucked. I keep hoping that they turn it around soon enough, and I think this season is the start of that.

[JCSunsfan]

Honestly, Indy brought up a couple things that are little worrisome. Do we know exactly what kind of training staff they have and how they've replaced or rebuilt the scouting staff? I also think that the thing to worry about the most is if the Suns get off to a slow start, will Sarver be able to keep himself from walking down to the coaches office to fire them up or do something drastically shortsighted?

I am not worried about the scouting staff, the previous regime was horrible.

As far as training staff, I do not think everyone left with Aaron Nelson.

[Superbone]

I heard one bit of scouting staff news the other day. Apparently, Ronnie Price was hired to the staff.

[SDC]

MVP?

[ShelC]

Yea Rubio won MVP of the tourney playing some great basketball. Great to see him play well after a down year in Utah and we'll need the kind of on-court leadership he showed the past few weeks. Just want him well rested to make sure he doesn't burn out or get injured.

[SDC]

Playoffs?

[Democritus]

Well done Ricky...now please be the MVP of our team.