???ShadowHawke wrote: ↑Fri Mar 12, 2021 8:39 pmMaybe someone should pay more attention when Ayton says he wants to pay his respects to Rasheed Wallace before the game.
Context? Details?.. What am I missing here?
???ShadowHawke wrote: ↑Fri Mar 12, 2021 8:39 pmMaybe someone should pay more attention when Ayton says he wants to pay his respects to Rasheed Wallace before the game.
That's ok, because he is clearly worth more than those 15M per even if he doesn't improve one iota; this is not 2010 anymore. I hate the hands, the low motor, the lack of awareness, etc., just like the rest of us, but I am at a point where I just appreciate Ayton for what he is instead of getting frustrated by what he is not or what he won't become. I really learned my lesson from Amare. Ayton is indeed frustrating but is still a very productive two-way player at a position of scarcity in today's NBA. Sad that he probably will never become a star, but you can count with the fingers of one hand how many big men can do what he actually does. 25M per is perfectly fine (20M per would be ideal and less is a terrific bargain). Now, a max contract (let alone an eventual supermax) is another story. But if I were the GM, I'd put those 20-25M on the table for an extension asap to keep him from hitting RFA, where I am sure someone will offer the absolute max (it would be strategically catastrophic to lose him for nothing or for your typical small s+t return).Split T wrote: ↑Fri Mar 12, 2021 6:54 pmWell I’d love to...I have serious doubts about getting him that cheap though...he clearly won’t sign that extension this summer. He’d push it out to restricted free agency and then we’re at the mercy of what other teams will pay...and I guarantee someone will give him more than 15 million a year.virtual9mm wrote: ↑Fri Mar 12, 2021 6:42 pmThen sign him for 15 million a year and call him a bargain.Split T wrote: ↑Fri Mar 12, 2021 5:42 pmI’m worried he is. We used to at least get flashes every few games or so. He’s been pretty meh since that 4 game stretch when we thought he figured it out. I just know I’m going to be really frustrated with him come playoff time and just wanting us to play Saric. I hope he makes me eat my words.Shabazz wrote: ↑Fri Mar 12, 2021 5:11 pmI don't disagree with the premise, but that would be an awful, awful return for Ayton and a fire-able offense for Jones.Split T wrote: ↑Fri Mar 12, 2021 6:42 amI didn’t watch last night, but sounds like another dud for DA...I’ll try to stop mentioning it, but I’d really just trade him now. It’s clearly selling short, but give me Nance, McGee and a protected 1st and I’ll take it. At this point we’ll be closing games in the playoffs with Saric anyways.
I just want Ayton to get back to where he was last year. I'd be happy with that. Is that too much to ask? Is he broken?
And ya, it’s a poor return. I just don’t really see what we can do with him. If he lays a dud in the playoffs, what do we do with him? He’ll be up for an extension and I think he’s clearly headed for less money than Bridges at this point...I’m sure we could move him in the offseason, but how much would we get? We have a short window right now with CP3 and we need to make each year count.
I’m just frustrated with his play and would rather not have to worry about it anymore...of course that’s not the best reason to trade someone...good thing I’m not the gm
max him if the deal is reasonable?
Which is why I’m in favor of trading Ayton. Though I’d rather keep him at 20 million a year than lose him for nothing. Mostly because that’s still a tradable asset.INFORMER wrote: ↑Sat Mar 13, 2021 12:02 pm$40 million a year committed to Ayton and Bridges is a lot of money for little production. OG Anunoby's extension screwed the market up, so yeah, you'll probably have to commit $20 mil per year on Bridges. But he is a guy that is just as likely to give you 8 points in a given night as he is 16 points.
You can't fill your roster with high priced role players that give you inconsistent production. You're locking yourself into long-term mediocrity. And maybe Jones/Sarver doesn't mind that. They might win a championship this year or next year and then spend the next 2-4 seasons battling for the 6-8 seeds. And that might be just fine for them.
I don’t think he has earned a max contract yet. Can we even afford three max contracts? Best case scenario seems to be him not being a max player and we get him for a reasonable amount. My main point is that we talk about him as if he was a total crappy player that we need to dump as soon as possible because he sucks so bad. We should dump him like the 400 centers that came before him that never measured up to our high standards. Is there even a center in Suns history that did measure up to our high standards? I don’t think so. I don’t know if Ayton is going to ever be a max player or not. I just don’t think he has earned the amount of disrespect he gets around here.Indy wrote: ↑Fri Mar 12, 2021 8:04 pmSo do you give him a max (or near max) contract? Because if you don't, someone else will. And then he will be gone and the Suns will get nothing for him.Nodack wrote: ↑Fri Mar 12, 2021 7:17 pmI don’t see it that way. He has his weaknesses. He has his nights where he isn’t so great. He seems to be kind of a slow learner and has questionable hands. He keeps the ball low instead of high where no guards can steal it. He seems to avoid dunking the ball. It can be frustrating to watch this perfect human specimen of a center’s not perform as we expect. Kanter had his way with Ayton on the boards. Ayton is #8 in boards. Kanter is #3. Perhaps a teaching moment for Ayton.
He has his nights where he kind of kicks ass and kind of dominates too. I can see where they have worked on and gotten better at the pick and roll with him this year. He overall stats are pretty impressive. Ayton was picked #1 over Doncic. Unless he’s the most dominant big man to ever put on a uniform he will be always be a disappointment to lot of Suns fans. Trade him now because he sucks? I don’t see it that way. Monty has been rewarding the best players that night with minutes in crunch time and Ayton doesn’t always get to play those minutes. Watching Dario dominate the paint in the fourth quarter is another teaching moment for Ayton. I am pulling for the guy even though he frustrates me. I am not for pushing a trade. I don’t think he is broken. He may never be the greatest center the NBA has ever seen but, so what? You guys would really take Kaminsky over Ayton as your center?
I don't agree with your comparison of Ayton to guys like Kanter. I think Ayton is a lot better, especially defensively, than those other guys. I wouldnt max him, certainly, but I think you aren't giving him his due.INFORMER wrote: ↑Sat Mar 13, 2021 2:09 pmAnd I'm not worried about a team offering Ayton a max contract. There is just too much talent in the league at the 5. It is very easy to find a productive, reliable big; just about every team has one. It's one of the reasons why Andre Drummond has zero trade value and why a double-double monster like Hassan Whiteside is attainable for the minimum.
Ayton isn't significantly better than Enes Kanter, Thomas Bryant, or Ivica Zubac, and none of those guys' salaries exceed Ayton's rookie salary. That's why Ayton at even $20 mil/yr is not an asset. He would moveable, but there won't be a line of suitors with substantial offers to acquire him.
Ding ding ding ding.INFORMER wrote: ↑Sat Mar 13, 2021 12:02 pm$40 million a year committed to Ayton and Bridges is a lot of money for little production. OG Anunoby's extension screwed the market up, so yeah, you'll probably have to commit $20 mil per year on Bridges. But he is a guy that is just as likely to give you 8 points in a given night as he is 16 points.
You can't fill your roster with high priced role players that give you inconsistent production. You're locking yourself into long-term mediocrity. And maybe Jones/Sarver doesn't mind that. They might win a championship this year or next year and then spend the next 2-4 seasons battling for the 6-8 seeds. And that might be just fine for them.