NBA Playoffs WCSF, Game 5: Dallas Mavericks @ Phoenix Suns (2-2), Tues 5/10/22

[Split T]

I'm thankful Monty pulled the plug on cam. Im not sure if it's a confidence thing with him or he got paid and he doesn't have to play like he used to but he was hurting us out there.

I really do think there’s something to him playing with rolling bigs…his good year+ came mostly with him playing alongside Saric. Having that space makes it easier for him to get to the rim. It’s also an easier pass to a pick n pop big rather than a rolling big. He doesn’t seem to have great chemistry or ability to hit a guy like McGee on the roll. He’s also not a good enough finisher to draw much help. He’s pretty strictly a blow by, straight line guy that needs to get all the way to the rim and isn’t going to finish over people. So he’s not much of a drive and kick guy either.

[AmareIsGod]

Nice video showing some good defense on Luka from Shamet. The tweet author is right that this is much better D than Payne typically plays:

He had several standout defensive possessions. Even during the regular season when I and others were riding his ass for not being able to hit any 3's, he played extraordinarily strong defense. I'm always surprised when he rises up for a ridiculous dunk. I think it all adds up to someone far more athletic than he appears which goes hand in hand with good defense.

[Superbone]

Cam Payne did lead all pg in plus/minus at +11


And yes I’m joking about that, he only played the final 3 minutes and honestly didn’t really do much. Shows the flaws of plus/minus.

It seems like it should be limited by the score/circumstance. If you are down 20 with 5 minutes left, I don't care about it. Or if you only play 6 minutes, I don't care about it unless it wasn't the end of the game and the score was close.

Or make a new stat +/- in meaningful minutes. PMMM.

[MightyMoog]

I think the bigger issue with Payne is on the defensive end in this series. He becomes the pigeon with a guy like Luka. So does Paul to an extent, but the Paul can easily get it back on the other end.

I think we’ll see Payne return against the warriors. Poole, allay and Steph can’t punish him in that way.

I’m also glad we went with Biyombo in this series. Javale is not a good matchup for the Dallas bigs. They like to shoot from 3. And they’re just tough enough to keep Javale off the offensive glass. Again, I see Javale having more success against the warriors.

[Split T]

Biyombo can switch onto Luka a little more easily as well.

I don’t really like Javale against the Warriors though. He absolutely would be a problem having to step up and defend guys like Curry and Poole. Warriors don’t play any size though, so we could definitely go small with Craig at the 5 in that series

[Nodack]

This years team is much more versatile. Glad to see Monty changing the lineup to matchup better with them since we have the pieces to do that.

[Indy]

I'm thankful Monty pulled the plug on cam. Im not sure if it's a confidence thing with him or he got paid and he doesn't have to play like he used to but he was hurting us out there.

He just can't play against Luka or Brunson on defense. And if his offense is gone, too, he doesn't give us anything. I am hoping his offense comes back. He can play more against the likes of Steph, Pool, Klay.

[JeremyG]

And Ayton couldn't score 40. I know this because his career high is 35.

Lol. Is that supposed to be a joke or something?

No more than his request for a 5-year max contract.

So would it have been reasonable in February to say that he couldn't score 35 because his career high at the time was 33?

If he got the touches, he could easily score 40.

[Indy]

And Ayton couldn't score 40. I know this because his career high is 35.

Lol. Is that supposed to be a joke or something?

No more than his request for a 5-year max contract.

So would it have been reasonable in February to say that he couldn't score 35 because his career high at the time was 33?

If he got the touches, he could easily score 40.

He would need 100 touches per game to get to 40.

And DA is 3rd on the team on touches per game excluding our PGs (who obviously have more touches than anyone). He gets 43 per game, which is just under Jae at 46 (because Jae comes out and takes the pass from the ball handler after they pick up their dribble, then he passes right back to get the play running again).

[AmareIsGod]

And Ayton couldn't score 40. I know this because his career high is 35.

Lol. Is that supposed to be a joke or something?

No more than his request for a 5-year max contract.

So would it have been reasonable in February to say that he couldn't score 35 because his career high at the time was 33?

If he got the touches, he could easily score 40.

He would need 100 touches per game to get to 40.

And DA is 3rd on the team on touches per game excluding our PGs (who obviously have more touches than anyone). He gets 43 per game, which is just under Jae at 46 (because Jae comes out and takes the pass from the ball handler after they pick up their dribble, then he passes right back to get the play running again).

How is Jae by the way? It looked like a severe shoulder injury. Maybe a dislocated shoulder or a torn labrum. I'm concerned.

[Indy]

Lol. Is that supposed to be a joke or something?

No more than his request for a 5-year max contract.

So would it have been reasonable in February to say that he couldn't score 35 because his career high at the time was 33?

If he got the touches, he could easily score 40.

He would need 100 touches per game to get to 40.

And DA is 3rd on the team on touches per game excluding our PGs (who obviously have more touches than anyone). He gets 43 per game, which is just under Jae at 46 (because Jae comes out and takes the pass from the ball handler after they pick up their dribble, then he passes right back to get the play running again).

How is Jae by the way? It looked like a severe shoulder injury. Maybe a dislocated shoulder or a torn labrum. I'm concerned.

He showed up in the tunnel to support Bizzy when Chriss started running after him. So I think he is ok.

[Flagrant Fowl]

And Ayton couldn't score 40. I know this because his career high is 35.

Lol. Is that supposed to be a joke or something?

No more than his request for a 5-year max contract.

So would it have been reasonable in February to say that he couldn't score 35 because his career high at the time was 33?

If he got the touches, he could easily score 40.

The guy is afraid to score over Spencer Dinwiddie when he's under the basket and you're telling me the reason he doesn't get 40 is because of touches?

[AmareIsGod]

And Ayton couldn't score 40. I know this because his career high is 35.

Lol. Is that supposed to be a joke or something?

No more than his request for a 5-year max contract.

So would it have been reasonable in February to say that he couldn't score 35 because his career high at the time was 33?

If he got the touches, he could easily score 40.

The guy is afraid to score over Spencer Dinwiddie when he's under the basket and you're telling me the reason he doesn't get 40 is because of touches?

I think his "fear" comes from the fact that he's a people pleaser to a fault. Not the fans, necessarily. But his teammates. "Don't want to get chewed out. Want to keep the teammates happy and not ballhog. Gotta be a team player". The reality is they are probably pissed frequently because he doesn't take the gimme and misses the bunny far too often.

[Flagrant Fowl]

Lol. Is that supposed to be a joke or something?

No more than his request for a 5-year max contract.

So would it have been reasonable in February to say that he couldn't score 35 because his career high at the time was 33?

If he got the touches, he could easily score 40.

The guy is afraid to score over Spencer Dinwiddie when he's under the basket and you're telling me the reason he doesn't get 40 is because of touches?

I think his "fear" comes from the fact that he's a people pleaser to a fault. Not the fans, necessarily. But his teammates. "Don't want to get chewed out. Want to keep the teammates happy and not ballhog. Gotta be a team player". The reality is they are probably pissed frequently because he doesn't take the gimme and misses the bunny far too often.

That's fine and all for a guy who's making Mikal Bridges type money. I really like Ayton. He's a good guy and a top 10 Center in the league.

But he's not a killer on the court, and having someone like that taking up 25% of the cap is a recipe for endless second round exits.

[Mori Chu]

That's fine and all for a guy who's making Mikal Bridges type money. I really like Ayton. He's a good guy and a top 10 Center in the league.

But he's not a killer on the court, and having someone like that taking up 25% of the cap is a recipe for endless second round exits.

He's a top-3 center in the league. Ahead of him are Jokic and Embiid. I would of course also put Giannis ahead of Ayton, but I don't think he is generally listed as a center.

[Flagrant Fowl]

That's fine and all for a guy who's making Mikal Bridges type money. I really like Ayton. He's a good guy and a top 10 Center in the league.

But he's not a killer on the court, and having someone like that taking up 25% of the cap is a recipe for endless second round exits.

He's a top-3 center in the league. Ahead of him are Jokic and Embiid. I would of course also put Giannis ahead of Ayton, but I don't think he is generally listed as a center.

I made my tiered list last week and I don't think Ayton is clearly better than a bunch of guys like Adebayo or Davis, for example. One game he's the fourth best (Giannis IS a Center), and the next he's the tenth best.

[Indy]

That's fine and all for a guy who's making Mikal Bridges type money. I really like Ayton. He's a good guy and a top 10 Center in the league.

But he's not a killer on the court, and having someone like that taking up 25% of the cap is a recipe for endless second round exits.

He's a top-3 center in the league. Ahead of him are Jokic and Embiid. I would of course also put Giannis ahead of Ayton, but I don't think he is generally listed as a center.

I made my tiered list last week and I don't think Ayton is clearly better than a bunch of guys like Adebayo or Davis, for example. One game he's the fourth best (Giannis IS a Center), and the next he's the tenth best.

exactly. wildly variable. I was hoping we would get a slightly improved Ayton over last year's playoffs. We get a much improved player a few games, and a regressed player others.

[Nodack]

I would like to see Holiday get some burn but maybe they think he’s too small for this series too. Peyton is pretty big for a guard…NO!!!!

[Superbone]

Who is up to the task of making the Game 6 thread?

[Drewsprocket]

That's fine and all for a guy who's making Mikal Bridges type money. I really like Ayton. He's a good guy and a top 10 Center in the league.

But he's not a killer on the court, and having someone like that taking up 25% of the cap is a recipe for endless second round exits.

He's a top-3 center in the league. Ahead of him are Jokic and Embiid. I would of course also put Giannis ahead of Ayton, but I don't think he is generally listed as a center.

I made my tiered list last week and I don't think Ayton is clearly better than a bunch of guys like Adebayo or Davis, for example. One game he's the fourth best (Giannis IS a Center), and the next he's the tenth best.

exactly. wildly variable. I was hoping we would get a slightly improved Ayton over last year's playoffs. We get a much improved player a few games, and a regressed player others.

I’m not sure where he goes from here. Part of me thinks without a CP3, he will lose focus and regress.