Suns News: Week 17 2/16-2/22

Discussion of the league and of our favorite team.
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Xylus
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Re: Suns News: Week 17 2/16-2/22

Post by Xylus »

specialsauce wrote:Nah, it's definitely IT. IT rolled in here with his big mouth and ego, probably has the backing of the FO and thug 1 and 2, and Dragic sees this and says fine then I'm out.
That's a lot of speculation.

jkalldaway
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Re: Suns News: Week 17 2/16-2/22

Post by jkalldaway »

If you have been nothing but loyal, said all the right things publicly, but had your job given to two other people - one of whom who didn't care to be here, and another who has stated that he thinks he should start over you - would you not have a problem with that?

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iLLmatic
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Re: Suns News: Week 17 2/16-2/22

Post by iLLmatic »

jkalldaway wrote:If you have been nothing but loyal, said all the right things publicly, but had your job given to two other people - one of whom who didn't care to be here, and another who has stated that he thinks he should start over you - would you not have a problem with that?
He averages 33 minutes a game, it's not like he became a bench warmer, he is getting time on the court. The offense may have not been centered completely around him which is what he wants, but the offense wasn't centered around him last year and he seemed content.

jkalldaway
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Re: Suns News: Week 17 2/16-2/22

Post by jkalldaway »

The offense was centered around him the majority of last year. And, he wasn't content the other parts of the year. In fact, that goes to show how professional he was being. He said today that it has been this way for 2 years and that he has tried to be professional but enough is enough.

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iLLmatic
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Re: Suns News: Week 17 2/16-2/22

Post by iLLmatic »

jkalldaway wrote:The offense was centered around him the majority of last year. And, he wasn't content the other parts of the year. In fact, that goes to show how professional he was being. He said today that it has been this way for 2 years and that he has tried to be professional but enough is enough.
So let's demand a trade 48 hours prior to the trade deadline? Yes, very professional. If he wasn't happy he could've told the Suns over the summer.

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Sunsfan4life
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Re: Suns News: Week 17 2/16-2/22

Post by Sunsfan4life »

But this is not what he said this off-season and as early as october. I don't have the article right in front of me but there was a quote like "I will opt out and sign with phoenix" then a few days later he said he would "like to see whats out there but prefers to remain in phoenix". But it was still his desire was to stay in Phoenix.

I do think the treatment, or how he thinks his brother should be treated, has a lot to do with this.
“Kobe had said (after the play) I wasn’t hugged enough as a child,” Bell recalled. “My mom kind of found him after the instance and we had beat them and offered him a hug in the bowels of the Phoenix arena. She really feels a part of that story.”

jkalldaway
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Re: Suns News: Week 17 2/16-2/22

Post by jkalldaway »

iLLmatic wrote:
jkalldaway wrote:The offense was centered around him the majority of last year. And, he wasn't content the other parts of the year. In fact, that goes to show how professional he was being. He said today that it has been this way for 2 years and that he has tried to be professional but enough is enough.
So let's demand a trade 48 hours prior to the trade deadline? Yes, very professional. If he wasn't happy he could've told the Suns over the summer.
The sporting news has reported that he talked with the Suns multiple times about his unhappiness and that they told him it would change. It didn't.

jkalldaway
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Re: Suns News: Week 17 2/16-2/22

Post by jkalldaway »

Sunsfan4life wrote:But this is not what he said this off-season and as early as october. I don't have the article right in front of me but there was a quote like "I will opt out and sign with phoenix" then a few days later he said he would "like to see whats out there but prefers to remain in phoenix". But it was still his desire was to stay in Phoenix.

I do think the treatment, or how he thinks his brother should be treated, has a lot to do with this.
Damned if you do, damned if you don't. He kept it out of the media and now you are using that against him. Now it is in the media and it is being used against him.

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Wally_West
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Re: Suns News: Week 17 2/16-2/22

Post by Wally_West »

If I'm McD, I'm checking on Jermaine O'Neal's status right now.

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iLLmatic
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Re: Suns News: Week 17 2/16-2/22

Post by iLLmatic »

jkalldaway wrote:
iLLmatic wrote:
jkalldaway wrote:The offense was centered around him the majority of last year. And, he wasn't content the other parts of the year. In fact, that goes to show how professional he was being. He said today that it has been this way for 2 years and that he has tried to be professional but enough is enough.
So let's demand a trade 48 hours prior to the trade deadline? Yes, very professional. If he wasn't happy he could've told the Suns over the summer.
The sporting news has reported that he talked with the Suns multiple times about his unhappiness and that they told him it would change. It didn't.
Link please?

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Cap
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Re: Suns News: Week 17 2/16-2/22

Post by Cap »

I'm checking on Generalísimo Francisco Franco's status right now.
“Are you crazy?! You think I’m going to go for seven years and try to get there? You enjoy the 2030 draft picks that we have holding? I want to try to see the game today.” — Ish 3/13/25

jkalldaway
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Re: Suns News: Week 17 2/16-2/22

Post by jkalldaway »

"While that meeting might be perceived as an act of brinksmanship on the part of Dragic, sources told Sporting News that, over the course of the year, Dragic’s camp has registered its complaints with Suns general manager Ryan McDonough on more than one occasion. But the Suns have not acted, and Dragic’s faith in the team has dwindled."

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carey
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Re: Suns News: Week 17 2/16-2/22

Post by carey »

538 on why Goran should go to a team that will put the ball in his hands: http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/gora ... enix-suns/
People close to the situation told USA Today’s Sam Amick that Dragic has chafed under the three-guard system created when the Suns executed a sign-and-trade deal for Isaiah Thomas last summer. Thomas was brought to Phoenix, in part, as insurance against the departure of Eric Bledsoe, whose restricted free agency hung over the team all summer. But the Suns found themselves with three top-flight (ball-dominant) guards once the Bledsoe drama was resolved in September. Naturally, sacrifices have been required: Dragic’s usage rate this season is the lowest it’s been since 2009-10, his second year in the NBA.

The hope would be that, as a player bears less responsibility in his team’s offense, he would be freed up to perform with greater efficiency. This idea of a trade-off between usage rate and efficiency was advanced by Dean Oliver (the current Sacramento Kings director of player personnel and analytics), who called it the “skill curve” effect more than a decade ago. And it has been demonstrated empirically across the entire population of NBA players. However, the devil is always in the details, and those details are why Dragic’s wins above replacement (WAR) tally has fallen; it was 8.8 a season ago but is on pace for 3.72 this year.

Although a general trade-off might hold for the average player, changes in a player’s efficiency also depend heavily on his teammates and overall style of play. When Dragic was at his best — he ranked as the NBA’s ninth-best guard by value over replacement player (VORP) between 2011-12 and 2013-14 — he had the ball in his hands a lot, penetrating and dishing. But a full season alongside Bledsoe (the duo only suited up for 38 games together in 2013-14) and the addition of Thomas have taken a toll on Dragic’s stats. His assist percentage is 19.5 percent this season, down from 28.1 percent a season ago and a high of 35.7 percent in 2012-13; his free-throw attempt rate is down to .191 from .381 last year; his true shooting percentage is down to .573 from .604 last season.

Using the player-tracking numbers at NBA.com, we see that Dragic’s touches per 36 minutes are down to 67.3 from 80.1 last season, and his drives per 36 minutes are down to 7.8 from 9.8 a year ago. Perhaps most telling, Dragic is only creating 10.3 points per 36 minutes with his passing, down from 15.1 last season. And according to Synergy numbers, isolations and pick-and-roll plays went from composing 49.4 percent of Dragic’s offensive game a year ago to 34.2 percent this season. Although skill curve theory might predict an uptick in efficiency with such a change, the reality is that Dragic’s effectiveness has cratered on the plays that were once his bread-and-butter. In 2013-14, he ranked in Synergy’s 91st percentile on pick-and-rolls and isolations; this season he ranks in the 43rd percentile.
Go Suns!

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Wally_West
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Re: Suns News: Week 17 2/16-2/22

Post by Wally_West »

Cap wrote:I'm checking on Generalísimo Francisco Franco's status right now.
Man, I must of heard so many times already. ;)

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carey
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Re: Suns News: Week 17 2/16-2/22

Post by carey »

jkalldaway wrote:"While that meeting might be perceived as an act of brinksmanship on the part of Dragic, sources told Sporting News that, over the course of the year, Dragic’s camp has registered its complaints with Suns general manager Ryan McDonough on more than one occasion. But the Suns have not acted, and Dragic’s faith in the team has dwindled."
That's because generally you don't get to go to management and tell them to trade players away because you're unhappy with how many times you handle the ball. I would have ignored him too as long as the team was winning. And we were. We were 14 of 18 before the recent slide.
Go Suns!

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carey
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Re: Suns News: Week 17 2/16-2/22

Post by carey »

Karl wanted to speak with Dragic. He declined and his agent advised the Kings he would under no circumstance resign. After his public comments the Celtics pulled out. Dragic's agent is trying to force his way to the big markets so he can get a five year deal.
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AmareIsGod
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Re: Suns News: Week 17 2/16-2/22

Post by AmareIsGod »

Thanks Goran. You and your agent have handled this admirably. Sounds less of a situation of being unhappy with his current role and wanting to run an offense on a good team and more like a guy wanting to play in the spotlight in a big market getting max dollars.

New York and Los Angeles. Really?

Groanin Goran is more like it. Amare wanted the money and the spotlight. Look where it all got him.

Bye Goran. It's a shame you and your agent decided to burn the bridges with the fans of the organization on the way out but if all of these leaks and reasons are true and Zoran refused to play in the D League, fuck both of them.
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Shabazz
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Re: Suns News: Week 17 2/16-2/22

Post by Shabazz »

If he lost trust in our front office he's in for a rude awakening with Jim Buss and James Dolan.

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Indy
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Re: Suns News: Week 17 2/16-2/22

Post by Indy »

Shabazz wrote:If he lost trust in our front office he's in for a rude awakening with Jim Buss and James Dolan.
So true.

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Re: Suns News: Week 17 2/16-2/22

Post by Indy »

AmareIsGod wrote:Amare wanted the money and the spotlight. Look where it all got him.
If you have a chance to grab 9 figures, you do it. That can buy a country in his part of the world.

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