Are The Suns Cursed? Book it!

[TOO]

But there is!!

Do tell Charles, do tell.

[Superbone]

All this extreme Booker talk is just fan frustration. It's not all his fault like some here like to say. He is what he is. He's not a superstar on a Kobe/Doncic/Jokic level. He's a very talented scorer and loyal player but he can't single-handedly break double teams. In fact, he doesn't handle them well. He holds onto the ball too long. He needs to start getting rid of it much sooner but he doesn't seem to be making any progress in that regard.

The coach should be helping with this. This should be a focus right now on how to handle double teams and to make plays to get him open. He is much better one-on-one but still not a premier ball handler.

And then defensively, this team is horrible. Other teams seem to be able to score at will. Is that all Booker's fault too? We don't seem to have the intensity on defense that other teams do. Is some of that personnel? Yes, but it doesn't excuse lack of effort on that end or better defensive schemes from the coaches.

Booker needs some help. He can't do it all alone. This team has a lot of issues and Booker isn't a player that can put it all on his back and single-handedly break double teams. He is more a 1B than a 1A. That's why he is so much better with a Chris Paul or a Kevin Durant. Until people learn this, they will continue to be frustrated and blame Booker for everything. Does he have some responsibility in all this? Of course he does. He's getting paid the super max or whatever it is. He needs to figure out how to better handle these double teams among other things.

[Kryptonic]

You guys are down bad…I’m gonna treat this like the Ayton thread and stay out

Is it down if it’s the same old crap or just venting? Sometimes people need to vent, split. No one should be force fed crap and expected to sit back and say “yum”. The only time this team is looking halfway decent is when everyone is healthy. Which isn’t possible for this team.

The KD trade doomed this team… Beal was the nail in the coffin. We rolled big with the dice and it failed… it happens. It’s time to blow it up and rebuild.

Unfortunately there isn't a real way to recoup all the assets it cost to build this current roster.

Corrrect but the longer you wait the worse off we’ll be trying to rebuild. That or we learn to just be content with what we have… enjoy the barely above .500 record we’ll have, with zero chance of a title.

Hey… at least we have each other

[Superbone]

You guys are down bad…I’m gonna treat this like the Ayton thread and stay out

Is it down if it’s the same old crap or just venting? Sometimes people need to vent, split. No one should be force fed crap and expected to sit back and say “yum”. The only time this team is looking halfway decent is when everyone is healthy. Which isn’t possible for this team.

The KD trade doomed this team… Beal was the nail in the coffin. We rolled big with the dice and it failed… it happens. It’s time to blow it up and rebuild.

Unfortunately there isn't a real way to recoup all the assets it cost to build this current roster.

Corrrect but the longer you wait the worse off we’ll be trying to rebuild. That or we learn to just be content with what we have… enjoy the barely above .500 record we’ll have, with zero chance of a title.

Hey… at least we have each other

I'm glad we have you, K!

But hasn't that been our MO of late? Holding on until it's too late. That's what we did with Ayton right? Reports were we could have had Sabonis or Miles Turner for him but we held on until the best we got was Nurk. Allen was a nice bonus perk. Those other centers would have been at least a more even trade and maybe even an upgrade. Definitely in effort. And I don't fault Nurkic's effort. He's just slow and lumbering without much touch around the basket but he give it his all.

The trading deadline will be interesting but on the other hand, the second apron is holding us down. How do you solve a problem like Maria...er, the Suns, top heavy money personnel, health issues, NTCs, and second apron? It is not easy. It will be interesting to see what Ishbia and his team do. Money is not an issue.

[Furlanfufi]

There are things we did that should made the team better (and did for the first 10 games).

We hired Tyus and Morris because we had no PG, but they don't start a lot of plays (and it's infuriating how many times Nurk or Plumlee dribble the ball to the offense after the rebound.)

We have a lot of good defensive players (Allen, Oneale, Dunn - and we KNOW Booker can be one and KD can too) but our team defense is ATROCIOUS.

Since we changed a lot of players and our coaching staff, the responsability falls on the best players. To lose to Orlando without Wagner and Banchero is not acceptable.

[The Bobster]

When Durant plays - 11-2
When Durant sits - 1-9

Clearly he's the MVP this year.

[Kryptonic]

When Durant plays - 11-2
When Durant sits - 1-9

Clearly he's the MVP this year.

Yea we’re a much better team to watch when he’s out there.

So like the league, if he misses more games will he still be eligible for your mvp? I kid, I kid.

[Superbone]

When Durant plays - 11-2
When Durant sits - 1-9

Clearly he's the MVP this year.

Yea we’re a much better team to watch when he’s out there.

So like the league, if he misses more games will he still be eligible for your mvp? I kid, I kid.

Yet, he alone isn't enough to make us a real candidate. The others have shown us that.

[1tinsoldier]

it does seem like the team is more confident when Durant is out there. His presence is respected by both sides, and at a minimum, the Durant/Booker combo does draw defensive attention and open up things.

another stat last week was that the team is 9th defensively with KD and Beal, and 27th without them. Beal does try hard defensively, but, like Booker, can be a little reckless and pick up fouls at crucial moments.

we've got some nice pieces. I especially like Allen. Even when his 3 is off, he still makes solid decisions, is active defensively and is a willing, capable driver and passer.

if the team is healthy, you'd think they'd be at least a 2nd round team, but not with 1on1 play even if the ball's in Durant's hands.

[1tinsoldier]

when are fans going to walk up and smell the coffee? We keep crashing because we're built on the wrong foundation -- Devin Booker. How many coaches has he been through now? Booker-ball is a loser. No coach has been hard and demanding because he was protected by the Sarver and the fans, who are still in denial.

he's crippling us with a supermax contract, making more than Durant, Lebron, Curry, etc.. Only 3 other NBA players make more. Fans are still talking about rebuilding around Book and Beal gets most of the blame, but Beal makes less and his overall stats are arguably better than Booker, including his defensive rating.

like last season, the Suns are again the worst clutch team in the NBA -- why? Booker is shooting like 10% in the last 2 minutes of close games - when he likes to take over.

move on. I'd trade Book for Butler, Austin Reeves, Lauri Markkanen or even roll the dice on Zion for a shot with him and Durant for the next 2 years, then rebuild. See if a Booker-Beal package works for anyone.

[The Bobster]

I'm all for trading Booker for a top-notch forward if they can, but Zion would bring the same kind of injury issues that the Suns already have with their "stars"

[Mori Chu]

Zion might be salvageable on the right new team with the right new training staff, coach, and teammates. But we all know in our hearts that we aren't that team. He would have to go someplace like the Heat, Spurs, etc. to find a better culture and fit. If he came here he'd just continue doing what he's always done, being injured, fat, and unbothered. He'd fit right in.

[Superbone]

Zion might be salvageable on the right new team with the right new training staff, coach, and teammates. But we all know in our hearts that we aren't that team. He would have to go someplace like the Heat, Spurs, etc. to find a better culture and fit. If he came here he'd just continue doing what he's always done, being injured, fat, and unbothered. He'd fit right in.

Hey, our guys aren't fat!

[The Bobster]

Zion might be salvageable on the right new team with the right new training staff, coach, and teammates. But we all know in our hearts that we aren't that team. He would have to go someplace like the Heat, Spurs, etc. to find a better culture and fit. If he came here he'd just continue doing what he's always done, being injured, fat, and unbothered. He'd fit right in.

Hey, our guys aren't fat!

"You can pull a muscle, but you can't pull fat." - John Daly

[1tinsoldier]

Zion might be salvageable on the right new team with the right new training staff, coach, and teammates. But we all know in our hearts that we aren't that team. He would have to go someplace like the Heat, Spurs, etc. to find a better culture and fit. If he came here he'd just continue doing what he's always done, being injured, fat, and unbothered. He'd fit right in.

that's a good point

i just think if we want to try and salvage this shot to compete for a title with Durant, we need to swing for the fences

if Bud was a stronger coach we might say our shot would be that this team is entirely healthy for the playoffs
as is, we're outside the playoffs, Bud's not changing Durant's style of play, Booker & Beal's bad decision making, and we have no functional center

[specialsauce]

when are fans going to walk up and smell the coffee? We keep crashing because we're built on the wrong foundation -- Devin Booker. How many coaches has he been through now? Booker-ball is a loser. No coach has been hard and demanding because he was protected by the Sarver and the fans, who are still in denial.

he's crippling us with a supermax contract, making more than Durant, Lebron, Curry, etc.. Only 3 other NBA players make more. Fans are still talking about rebuilding around Book and Beal gets most of the blame, but Beal makes less and his overall stats are arguably better than Booker, including his defensive rating.

like last season, the Suns are again the worst clutch team in the NBA -- why? Booker is shooting like 10% in the last 2 minutes of close games - when he likes to take over.

move on. I'd trade Book for Butler, Austin Reeves, Lauri Markkanen or even roll the dice on Zion for a shot with him and Durant for the next 2 years, then rebuild. See if a Booker-Beal package works for anyone.

Booker for Cunningham and Duren

[1tinsoldier]

this post is a non-appreciation of the die-hard Booker fans who doomed this franchise. Look away if you're still one of them. Or if you're not up for a long, painful read.

it started with Booker being the owner's pet (Sarver). For the first half of Booker's decade in phx (leading a bottom-feeding team), fans had reason to believe his ceiling was unlimited. But he never showed signs of correcting his weaknesses until CP3 arrived. CP3's 2nd season turned into the Suns best ever, but ended with a Luka induced meltdown. Suns fans were ready to blow it up. But they quickly returned to Booker's corner while CP3 was discarded without even an offer of a reduced role and salary.

The Suns #1 clutch shooting turned into the NBA's worst and struggles to make the playoffs. A (finally) healthy pair of superstars alongside Booker couldn't keep them from being swept in round 1. Though Booker performed poorly in the series, the cries to blow the team up again turned into "blame everyone but Booker." Objectively, the evidence indicates the opposite.

Durant is the team's top scorer and most consistent, including in the clutch. The team is 1 and 10 without him. Booker has been inconsistent, his clutch shooting is 18%, and he's the worst rated defender in Suns history -- currently ranked 12th worst in the league.

Booker fans cite his "loyalty" as a reason to keep him. But it's the Suns loyalty that stands out. Phx management never denied him anything, including one of the top 5 salaries in the world, 7 different coaches who allowed him to play "Booker ball," and 4 or 5 roster rebuilds around him. Despite his statistical failings and lack of results, he was never "on the table" and, bizarrely, still isn't. And despite him making $18,000 per minute on the floor, critiquing his performance is generally dismissed as "Booker hating."

Today, Arizona sports demonstrated their as-usual protection of the company's best selling product with this remark: "I'm not blaming Booker. To be clear, I'm not blaming Booker, but you have to take a look at the common denominator. Who's been with the Suns through all of their problems. Only Devin Booker and James Jones." Get it? The scapegoat is now James Jones for putting together a team that still looks great on paper (except for having it's 2 top player's into iso ball, but that's for the coach to correct). Jones now follows Nurkic as the scapegoat. But 2 months without Nurk was even worse, so Bradley Beal took the blame -- though his overall offense and defense stats per minute blurs the line between his value and Booker's.

And that bring us to the steaming pile of crap we're sitting in today. Beal should feel dismissed. Tyus Jones should be pissed. He was told he was needed, but the failed Point-Book experiment still, too often, continues. Hall of Famer, Kevin Durant should feel dissed because, despite him being relatively healthy, the team's best performer, and exactly the guy the Suns traded for, the team's tried to unload his 2 year salary instead of the other super-max guy's 4 year commitment though he didn't even make the All Star team.

Booker fans asked for it again. And got it again. Another dysfunctional team going nowhere behind their home-grown, Michigan-born favorite. Enjoy the next 100 hours of sub-par basketball played by uninspired, unbonded teammates going nowhere. Then, you can talk about the next Booker rebuild all summer.

good luck

[Kryptonic]

100%…. I love booker, have more of his jerseys than any other sun and even I say trade him for pieces that fills the roster holes. If anything, do it this summer. You can’t trade KD and build around Beal and Book…. They’re just too redundant. Seriously it’s hard to say that and love book…. But it’s the easiest way to build for a title. The only way we keep book, is by trading Beal and KD and I’d be fine with that too but you’d need to make sure whoever is brought in is an alpha and leader, because book ain’t it.

[1tinsoldier]

100%…. I love booker, have more of his jerseys than any other sun and even I say trade him for pieces that fills the roster holes. If anything, do it this summer. You can’t trade KD and build around Beal and Book…. They’re just too redundant. Seriously it’s hard to say that and love book…. But it’s the easiest way to build for a title. The only way we keep book, is by trading Beal and KD and I’d be fine with that too but you’d need to make sure whoever is brought in is an alpha and leader, because book ain’t it.

yes, Krypt, but there are only 2 NBA players impactful enough to make a duo with Booker competitive and one just went to LA and the other isn't leaving Denver. If Book wasn't a super-max player you might have room to add enough talent at each position but even Ishbia can't afford to sustain that.

[Superbone]

100%…. I love booker, have more of his jerseys than any other sun and even I say trade him for pieces that fills the roster holes. If anything, do it this summer. You can’t trade KD and build around Beal and Book…. They’re just too redundant. Seriously it’s hard to say that and love book…. But it’s the easiest way to build for a title. The only way we keep book, is by trading Beal and KD and I’d be fine with that too but you’d need to make sure whoever is brought in is an alpha and leader, because book ain’t it.

yes, Krypt, but there are only 2 NBA players impactful enough to make a duo with Booker competitive and one just went to LA and the other isn't leaving Denver. If Book wasn't a super-max player you might have room to add enough talent at each position but even Ishbia can't afford to sustain that.

Yes he can. He's got three major contracts right now. Now, it's just about spending the rest of the money wisely on the right complementary pieces. You know, team building. Once KD and Beal are off the books, he'll have plenty to work with.