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Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2023 1:09 pm
by JeremyG
Flagrant Fowl wrote: ↑Tue Nov 07, 2023 1:00 am
Split T wrote: ↑Tue Nov 07, 2023 12:35 am
He’s also somehow setting career lows in free throw rate(in fact only 9 guys in the nba have a lower rate and 6 are guards…3 forwards). He also has careers lows in field goal attempts, usage rate, and a career high in turnover rate. Plus barely above his career low in TS%
It’s a mixed bag for sure. But it does seem like he’s quite engaged on the defensive end at least…and the boards.
So it seems it was never about offensive opportunity to keep him engaged, and it's always been up to him to more consistently play hard.
Sounds like what a lot of us said for the two previous seasons when his super fans wanted to create every excuse possible for him when he loafed around.
So he would have played hard like this for a new coach like Vogel--is that what you're saying?
But the whole "feeding the big to keep him engaged" is a real thing. It's true for almost all big men, especially talented bigs and especially those with offensive talent. It's just the way they are. Just ask Shaq. And Vogel himself acknowledged it over the summer.
He's on a new team so it's the honeymoon phase. But they do need to start getting him the ball or else this level of defensive engagement will not continue long term.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2023 1:16 pm
by Split T
DA is not Shaq though…Gobert also complained about touches and wanted the ball, but he always stayed engaged defensively. DA is much closer to Rudy than he is Shaq.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2023 2:01 pm
by Superbone
virtual9mm wrote: ↑Tue Nov 07, 2023 5:31 am
Split T wrote: ↑Tue Nov 07, 2023 12:35 am
He’s getting a lot of rebounds and steals…The rebounds should be sustainable…I doubt the steals are…but maybe he’s made a major shift in how he plays. His steal rate in Phoenix was 1.1…he’s at 3.7 right now. Seems like a sample size error, but we’ll see.
He’s also somehow setting career lows in free throw rate(in fact only 9 guys in the nba have a lower rate and 6 are guards…3 forwards). He also has careers lows in field goal attempts, usage rate, and a career high in turnover rate. Plus barely above his career low in TS%
It’s a mixed bag for sure. But it does seem like he’s quite engaged on the defensive end at least…and the boards.
Would have been the perfect Ayton for the Suns, in all honesty. Garbage man on offense, all nba defender.
He would have pouted on the Suns though. In a year or two, he'll revert to his previous two year ways for the Blazers too.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2023 2:02 pm
by Superbone
JeremyG wrote: ↑Tue Nov 07, 2023 1:09 pm
He's on a new team so it's the honeymoon phase. But they do need to start getting him the ball or else this level of defensive engagement will not continue long term.
We are in agreement here.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2023 2:38 pm
by JeremyG
It's pretty sad that Ayton never got an appreciation thread on here when he was traded. Shows how much Hayton there is.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2023 2:41 pm
by Superbone
JeremyG wrote: ↑Tue Nov 07, 2023 2:38 pm
It's pretty sad that Ayton never got an appreciation thread on here when he was traded. Shows how much Hayton there is.
You're right. He should have gotten one. The Finals year was special.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2023 2:43 pm
by Flagrant Fowl
I don't appreciate quitters.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2023 2:51 pm
by Mori Chu
JeremyG wrote: ↑Tue Nov 07, 2023 2:38 pm
It's pretty sad that Ayton never got an appreciation thread on here when he was traded. Shows how much Hayton there is.
That's true; even Jae Crowder got a goodbye appreciation thread:
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2683
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2023 2:52 pm
by Superbone
Flagrant Fowl wrote: ↑Tue Nov 07, 2023 2:43 pm
I don't appreciate quitters.
Well, there's that. It's true it's hard to appreciate his contribution up to the Finals year without acknowledging the two years after that. Pretty sure that's why said thread never was made. Although there was nothing stopping Jeremy from making one. But I'm sure he knew the Hayters would have been out in full force.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2023 2:52 pm
by Superbone
Mori Chu wrote: ↑Tue Nov 07, 2023 2:51 pm
JeremyG wrote: ↑Tue Nov 07, 2023 2:38 pm
It's pretty sad that Ayton never got an appreciation thread on here when he was traded. Shows how much Hayton there is.
That's true; even Jae Crowder got a goodbye appreciation thread:
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2683
Yeah, a lot of action in that one.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2023 2:55 pm
by Flagrant Fowl
I'd argue 200+ pages to discuss a role player is enough appreciation.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2023 3:15 pm
by JeremyG
Eric Gordon just said on Burns & Gambo that Ayton was a big reason he joined Team Bahamas and that he wanted to help "get his [DA's] mind right before the season." He said he anticipated at least starting the season with him, but he could tell in the playoffs there was a "disconnect" between DA and the team.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2023 3:32 pm
by Wally_West
Flagrant Fowl wrote: ↑Tue Nov 07, 2023 2:55 pm
I'd argue 200+ pages to discuss a role player is enough appreciation.
We shooting for 300 now
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2023 3:51 pm
by Split T
This is All Things Ayton…appreciation is part of All Things, so we did have an appreciation thread.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2023 3:57 pm
by SunsRIt
At this point I think it’s a good riddance thread.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2023 4:03 pm
by Split T
It’s all the above, that was the point of the thread…At least it’s what became the point of the thread. We’ve probably discussed Ayton more than any player on this board.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2023 4:27 pm
by Superbone
Split T wrote: ↑Tue Nov 07, 2023 3:51 pm
This is All Things Ayton…appreciation is part of All Things, so we did have an appreciation thread.
Yep, there has been a TON of Ayton praise in this thread! Albeit mostly from a single poster.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2023 4:28 pm
by Superbone
Split T wrote: ↑Tue Nov 07, 2023 4:03 pm
It’s all the above, that was the point of the thread…At least it’s what became the point of the thread. We’ve probably discussed Ayton more than any player on this board.
He's been the most polarizing figure in recent Suns' history. I believe mostly due to his draft position and salary.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2023 4:39 pm
by Split T
And the fact that his box score numbers can look good. A few advanced stats thought he was better than Booker…that invites a lot of discussion on what’s more important, a ball handler who creates shots for themselves(even if they are less efficient) and others, or the guy who just finishes shots created for him at a very high level.
Re: All Things Ayton
Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2023 5:09 pm
by specialsauce
If Ayton made $15M per year I would think very differently of him, even if he’s still considered a bust because of where he was drafted
