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Re: Suns Off-Season Thread
Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 12:40 pm
by JeremyG
Indy wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 12:11 pm
JeremyG wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 12:02 pm
Indy wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 8:44 am
specialsauce wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 10:15 pm
JeremyG wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 10:54 am
See that's the problem with the Suns' front office. They're literally insane.
So much for everyone's dreams of landing KAT.
Also, do they not understand there's going to be a jump in the salary cap? Over $30M will be nothing.
And this argument (likely coming from the team) is just so shortsighted it's almost hilarious:
Yeah, maybe Paul could...for what? Another 0.5 years? Lol.
Our 2 biggest problems haunting us for our future (and that destroyed us this postseason):
1. Monty's love for Chris.
2. Monty's hate for Deandre.
Bingo
Do you really believe this?
Obviously we're exaggerating a little bit. When I say "hate" I mean: "dislike for him as a player/bias against him/putting him under a harsher microscope than his teammates/not wanting to feature him in the offense."
You think Monty has disliked DA and that is why DA doesn't perform up to his ability?
And have you watched enough of Ayton being the center of an offense? Tell me the last time he was the focus of an offense and that team won.
I didn't say he should be "the center of an offense" or "the focus." But #2 offensive option sounds about right. But to answer your question, we won Game 1 of the second round with him as our leading scorer/shot attempter.
Re: Suns Off-Season Thread
Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 1:03 pm
by Wally_West
Split T wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 12:18 pm
He’s wrong though…he says you can’t just keep adding players to make it work, the math is the math, but it doesn’t look like he did the math.
KD has a 44.1 million dollar salary next year which means they can take up to 55.1 million in salary back.
In order for the trade to work for the suns, they’d need to send out at least 35.5 million.
The BYC stuff makes things tricky, but there is still wiggle room.
Ayton+Mikal for instance would be about 51.4 million in salary(30.5 for Ayton and 20.9 for Mikal), so that works for Brooklyn.
That same deal would count for 36.1 for us(15.2 for Ayton and 20.9 for Mikal) so it works for Phoenix too.
But it does hard cap Brooklyn at the luxury tax apron and if they are already over the luxury tax apron they can’t do it. If Kyrie opts in they are over. If he opts out this trade is legal.
This post made my dick hard. Time for some rosterbation!!
So our starting line-up would be:
Starting: CP3-Book-KD-Crowder-Dario
Bench: Payne-Shamet-Ish-CJ-Byiombo(re-signs)
Or Maybe trade Crowder, Payne and Craig and future first for Jerami Grant as well.
If you could add Patty Mills on the minimum too.
CP-Book-KD-Grant-Dario
Mills-Shamet-Ish-CJ-Byiombo
Re: Suns Off-Season Thread
Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 1:14 pm
by Indy
JeremyG wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 12:40 pm
Indy wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 12:11 pm
JeremyG wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 12:02 pm
Indy wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 8:44 am
Do you really believe this?
Obviously we're exaggerating a little bit. When I say "hate" I mean: "dislike for him as a player/bias against him/putting him under a harsher microscope than his teammates/not wanting to feature him in the offense."
You think Monty has disliked DA and that is why DA doesn't perform up to his ability?
And have you watched enough of Ayton being the center of an offense? Tell me the last time he was the focus of an offense and that team won.
I didn't say he should be "the center of an offense" or "the focus." But #2 offensive option sounds about right. But to answer your question, we won Game 1 of the second round with him as our leading scorer/shot attempter.
Sorry for my vagueness. I meant when is a time his team won consistently doing that? Just one game doesn't mean much. You can say we just haven't allowed him to do it (although my argument still stands about his options in so many plays in every game), but did it work in college when he was the best player on the team? Nope. Did it work in high school? I have no idea. I am just looking for something that shows me Ayton is a dominant basketball player.
Re: Suns Off-Season Thread
Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 1:47 pm
by Drewsprocket
Mikal is probably too much to give up. I’d argue Bridges is more valuable player than Ayton. He’s an iron man, best wing defender, glue guy, has many years to go.
Cam J and Ayton is alone is a lot with expiring contracts.
Re: Suns Off-Season Thread
Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 1:51 pm
by JeremyG
Indy wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 1:14 pm
JeremyG wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 12:40 pm
Indy wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 12:11 pm
JeremyG wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 12:02 pm
Indy wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 8:44 am
Do you really believe this?
Obviously we're exaggerating a little bit. When I say "hate" I mean: "dislike for him as a player/bias against him/putting him under a harsher microscope than his teammates/not wanting to feature him in the offense."
You think Monty has disliked DA and that is why DA doesn't perform up to his ability?
And have you watched enough of Ayton being the center of an offense? Tell me the last time he was the focus of an offense and that team won.
I didn't say he should be "the center of an offense" or "the focus." But #2 offensive option sounds about right. But to answer your question, we won Game 1 of the second round with him as our leading scorer/shot attempter.
Sorry for my vagueness. I meant when is a time his team won consistently doing that? Just one game doesn't mean much. You can say we just haven't allowed him to do it (although my argument still stands about his options in so many plays in every game), but did it work in college when he was the best player on the team? Nope. Did it work in high school? I have no idea. I am just looking for something that shows me Ayton is a dominant basketball player.
I don't think I've ever said he should be the best player on the team or our #1 option. #2 next to Booker is fine with me. And I don't think DA himself would have a problem being #2. If he grows into a #1, great. If not, then I think he can definitely be a great #2.
Re: Suns Off-Season Thread
Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 2:08 pm
by Indy
I guess that is where we differ. I can't see him ever being aggressive enough to be a #2 on a great team. To do that, you need to get your own buckets against playoff defenses that are game planning to stop you from getting your own buckets.
Re: Suns Off-Season Thread
Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 2:08 pm
by TOO
Ayton has no bag, he cannot get his own shot at will, you need that to be a second option, he doesn't have it.
Re: Suns Off-Season Thread
Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 2:09 pm
by TOO
Indy wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:08 pm
I guess that is where we differ. I can't see him ever being aggressive enough to be a #2 on a great team. To do that, you need to get your own buckets against playoff defenses that are game planning to stop you from getting your own buckets.
Like minds and such.
Re: Suns Off-Season Thread
Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 2:20 pm
by Split T
Drewsprocket wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 1:47 pm
Mikal is probably too much to give up. I’d argue Bridges is more valuable player than Ayton. He’s an iron man, best wing defender, glue guy, has many years to go.
Cam J and Ayton is alone is a lot with expiring contracts.
I don’t think you’re getting KD without Mikal
Re: Suns Off-Season Thread
Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 2:23 pm
by Indy
Split T wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:20 pm
Drewsprocket wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 1:47 pm
Mikal is probably too much to give up. I’d argue Bridges is more valuable player than Ayton. He’s an iron man, best wing defender, glue guy, has many years to go.
Cam J and Ayton is alone is a lot with expiring contracts.
I don’t think you’re getting KD without Mikal
Agreed. I mean the chance of us getting KD at all is unlikely. But trying to do it without giving up what is likely our best bang-for-buck player is crazy.
Re: Suns Off-Season Thread
Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 2:26 pm
by Indy
TOO wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:09 pm
Indy wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:08 pm
I guess that is where we differ. I can't see him ever being aggressive enough to be a #2 on a great team. To do that, you need to get your own buckets against playoff defenses that are game planning to stop you from getting your own buckets.
Like minds and such.
Yeah. To be a #2 on a great team means you could be a #1 on a really good team. Meaning still get buckets each night, and make the right reads when the defense shuts you down, and getting to the line. And to do all that as a Center, you need to have the "go ahead and get in my way and I will fucking knock you down and try and throw the ball at your head as it goes through rim and you see my feet coming down on you" mentality.
Re: Suns Off-Season Thread
Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 2:49 pm
by Drewsprocket
Indy wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:23 pm
Split T wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:20 pm
Drewsprocket wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 1:47 pm
Mikal is probably too much to give up. I’d argue Bridges is more valuable player than Ayton. He’s an iron man, best wing defender, glue guy, has many years to go.
Cam J and Ayton is alone is a lot with expiring contracts.
I don’t think you’re getting KD without Mikal
Agreed. I mean the chance of us getting KD at all is unlikely. But trying to do it without giving up what is likely our best bang-for-buck player is crazy.
Yikes guys. We’re talking year 16 or 15 however you look at it. In the past 3 years he has missed one season, played 35 games, then 55 games respectively. I think JJ is savvy enough to hold off on letting go. I could be wrong. Just feels like a gigantic risk. We’d essentially be a weak defensive team. I’m not sure we’d get past GSW without Bridges.
Re: Suns Off-Season Thread
Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 2:55 pm
by Split T
It’s KD, he’s a top 10 all time guy and he’s still a top 5 player in the league, and has a game that will age very well. Ya health is a concern, but sometimes you gotta take the chance.
Losing bridges would obviously hurt, but the suns become nearly un-guardable with KD
Re: Suns Off-Season Thread
Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 3:13 pm
by Superbone
SunsRIt wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 10:31 am
Interesting take on Booker and Paul.
WAY too early to be saying that about Book. Having said that, I hope they both see this video and it motivates them next year and for the years to come (Book).
Re: Suns Off-Season Thread
Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 3:13 pm
by SunsRIt
Hot Rod Williams here we come.
Re: Suns Off-Season Thread
Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 3:25 pm
by Mori Chu
I said it in another thread. If KD is gettable, I'd give up literally any assets we have other than Booker. They want Mikal and Ayton, I would be sad to lose Mikal (he'd be amazing alongside Book and KD as an uber role player and defensive stopper) but you'd have to do it if that's what it took. Feels like one of those rosterbation things though where it is very unlikely to happen. Kind of interesting to see some people close to KD hinting about things though, like his podcast partner hinting that big news is dropping soon.
Re: Suns Off-Season Thread
Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 4:03 pm
by ShelC
I don't think getting KD is as farfetched as it sounds. He's a legit darkhorse, just a matter of figuring out the trade/numbers.
Re: Suns Off-Season Thread
Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 4:19 pm
by TOO
SunsRIt wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 3:13 pm
Hot Rod Williams here we come.
It's not like you NEED an elite C to win in the league anymore.
Re: Suns Off-Season Thread
Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 4:23 pm
by Split T
Mori Chu wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 3:25 pm
I said it in another thread. If KD is gettable, I'd give up literally any assets we have other than Booker. They want Mikal and Ayton, I would be sad to lose Mikal (he'd be amazing alongside Book and KD as an uber role player and defensive stopper) but you'd have to do it if that's what it took. Feels like one of those rosterbation things though where it is very unlikely to happen. Kind of interesting to see some people close to KD hinting about things though, like his podcast partner hinting that big news is dropping soon.
I’d go as far as Ayton, Cam J, contracts, and 3 1sts to try and hang onto Mikal, but I’m pretty sure they’d hold fast on Mikal being involved. Our only hope would be KD pulling whatever strings he can to scare off any other pursuers and force Brooklyn to take our offer.
Re: Suns Off-Season Thread
Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 4:25 pm
by Split T
TOO wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 4:19 pm
SunsRIt wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 3:13 pm
Hot Rod Williams here we come.
It's not like you NEED an elite C to win in the league anymore.
The 4 starting centers left are Kevon Looney, Dwight Powell, Bam Adebayo, and Robert Williams(or Horford I guess).
Looney and Powell often only play 15 minutes or less too.
Our 3 All-NBA centers lost in the 1st round, 1st round, 2nd round.
