Game Day: Suns (17-30) @ Pacers (25-22), Wed 1/24/18

[ShelC]

It was a bad draft going in and we weren't going to take a PG like Dunn because we (McD) was still committed to Bledsoe and we had out SG in Booker so no point in Hield (not that I was crazy about him either). We needed bigs and Bender was the consensus but we doubled down on Chriss. Should've traded out of the lotto and acquired a future lotto or something. Instead, we compounded things by taking 2 marginal bigs.

[specialsauce]

I wanted Dunn or Hield. I would have traded down.

[specialsauce]

Even if you don’t think they blew it, he still lacks any aggression and his age isn’t an excuse for how passive he is.

[Split T]

I don't know why you don't think his age/experience can't be a reason for his lack of aggression. I'm not saying he can turn into Westbrook, but is it that hard to believe a guy who's been playing with older and more experienced players tends to defer to his older and better players?

[Cap]

Yeah, the #4 pick in the 2016 draft wasn't worth nearly as much as the #4 pick in a normal draft, so we should have traded it for something that was. Surely the NBA is full of GMs ready to go, "Oh boy, #4 pick!!!" and trade for it without bothering to look at who's in the draft.

[O_Gardino]

Yeah, the #4 pick in the 2016 draft wasn't worth nearly as much as the #4 pick in a normal draft, so we should have traded it for something that was. Surely the NBA is full of GMs ready to go, "Oh boy, #4 pick!!!" and trade for it without bothering to look at who's in the draft.

Well, that was us with the 8th pick.

[specialsauce]

I don't know why you don't think his age/experience can't be a reason for his lack of aggression. I'm not saying he can turn into Westbrook, but is it that hard to believe a guy who's been playing with older and more experienced players tends to defer to his older and better players?

Because players don't just change their personality type as they grow older. He's not 12.

Amare came into the league aggressive straight out of high school.

Look at Ayton right now. Bagley. Josh Jackson. Sure, the argument can be that these guys are a different caliber player than Bender. But you can go up and down the draft picks the last 5 years and I bet you can't find a single player more passive than him.

I don't know why you think he'll magically become aggressive when he hits 21 years of age. I have never seen anybody so passive in my entire life watching the league. This is not just a marker of age. You're convincing yourself it's because he's young to make it more acceptable.

[Split T]

Yeah, the #4 pick in the 2016 draft wasn't worth nearly as much as the #4 pick in a normal draft, so we should have traded it for something that was. Surely the NBA is full of GMs ready to go, "Oh boy, #4 pick!!!" and trade for it without bothering to look at who's in the draft.

Well, that was us with the 8th pick.

Well, we really just traded more picks in that same terrible draft

[specialsauce]

Yeah, the #4 pick in the 2016 draft wasn't worth nearly as much as the #4 pick in a normal draft, so we should have traded it for something that was. Surely the NBA is full of GMs ready to go, "Oh boy, #4 pick!!!" and trade for it without bothering to look at who's in the draft.

We could easily have traded down for a future pick (even if heavily protected) and taken Hield/Murray/Chriss/etc.

[iLLmatic]

It's crazy that Monroe, Knight, Dudley, and Chandler comprise 60% of our salary cap.

[Split T]

Yeah, the #4 pick in the 2016 draft wasn't worth nearly as much as the #4 pick in a normal draft, so we should have traded it for something that was. Surely the NBA is full of GMs ready to go, "Oh boy, #4 pick!!!" and trade for it without bothering to look at who's in the draft.

We could easily have traded down for a future pick (even if heavily protected) and taken Hield/Murray/Chriss/etc.

Hield and Murray went 6 and 7, I'm not sure how we trade down and still draft them. Chriss? Sure we could have but if we wanted hield or Murray we needed to draft them at 4

[Cap]

What we could have gotten for trading down is probably comparable in value to what we gave away to trade up from #13 to #8. I consider that package pretty darn insignificant, though I understand that some people have a serious issue with it.

[ShelC]

The only guy I really liked going in was Sabonis and we could've traded back and gotten him. Even then, his upside was limited but you were getting a nice, skilled, 4/5 with a high bball IQ.
Maker was intriguing but I didn't want us taking a raw, project who's more athlete than basketball player.

[JCSunsfan]

The only guy I really liked going in was Sabonis and we could've traded back and gotten him. Even then, his upside was limited but you were getting a nice, skilled, 4/5 with a high bball IQ.
Maker was intriguing but I didn't want us taking a raw, project who's more athlete than basketball player.

I loved him, but was roundly mocked by nearly everyone for thinking he would be a good pick. People here were ecstatic about getting Bender and Chriss. Hindsight. The superiority juice of message board posters everywhere.

[Superbone]

I don't know why you don't think his age/experience can't be a reason for his lack of aggression. I'm not saying he can turn into Westbrook, but is it that hard to believe a guy who's been playing with older and more experienced players tends to defer to his older and better players?

Because players don't just change their personality type as they grow older. He's not 12.

Amare came into the league aggressive straight out of high school.

Look at Ayton right now. Bagley. Josh Jackson. Sure, the argument can be that these guys are a different caliber player than Bender. But you can go up and down the draft picks the last 5 years and I bet you can't find a single player more passive than him.

I don't know why you think he'll magically become aggressive when he hits 21 years of age. I have never seen anybody so passive in my entire life watching the league. This is not just a marker of age. You're convincing yourself it's because he's young to make it more acceptable.

Maybe he is an angry drunk?

[O_Gardino]

The only guy I really liked going in was Sabonis and we could've traded back and gotten him. Even then, his upside was limited but you were getting a nice, skilled, 4/5 with a high bball IQ.
Maker was intriguing but I didn't want us taking a raw, project who's more athlete than basketball player.

I loved him, but was roundly mocked by nearly everyone for thinking he would be a good pick. People here were ecstatic about getting Bender and Chriss. Hindsight. The superiority juice of message board posters everywhere.

Lots of people loved Sabonis.

[specialsauce]

I don't know why you don't think his age/experience can't be a reason for his lack of aggression. I'm not saying he can turn into Westbrook, but is it that hard to believe a guy who's been playing with older and more experienced players tends to defer to his older and better players?

Because players don't just change their personality type as they grow older. He's not 12.

Amare came into the league aggressive straight out of high school.

Look at Ayton right now. Bagley. Josh Jackson. Sure, the argument can be that these guys are a different caliber player than Bender. But you can go up and down the draft picks the last 5 years and I bet you can't find a single player more passive than him.

I don't know why you think he'll magically become aggressive when he hits 21 years of age. I have never seen anybody so passive in my entire life watching the league. This is not just a marker of age. You're convincing yourself it's because he's young to make it more acceptable.

Maybe he is an angry drunk?

I was actually thinking maybe they need him to develop an alcohol problem

[Indy]

The only guy I really liked going in was Sabonis and we could've traded back and gotten him. Even then, his upside was limited but you were getting a nice, skilled, 4/5 with a high bball IQ.
Maker was intriguing but I didn't want us taking a raw, project who's more athlete than basketball player.

I loved him, but was roundly mocked by nearly everyone for thinking he would be a good pick. People here were ecstatic about getting Bender and Chriss. Hindsight. The superiority juice of message board posters everywhere.

Lots of people loved Sabonis.

exactly

[Superbone]

I wanted Sabonis.

[LazarusLong]

I wanted Sabonis.

Add me to the list.